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Is Archbishop Chaput aware of this? Imagine that degree of control of others from the grave. Pretty scary.

It is scary and silly too. He set it up quite nicely.

So, when the house of cards began to tumble, the most well-integrated among the LC and RC whispered proudly to each other: "He TOLD us this would happen."

"And [Maciel] expressed to us as a fundamental element of his faith and of his confidence the example of what happened to the Church upon the death of its Founder; for it was the death and resurrection that united the COFOUNDERS OF THE CHURCH in love and in obedience to the Holy Spirit" [emphasis mine]

Anther example of
Legion = Church
Malice = Christ.

I don't believe the Church was EVER considered to have cofounders. St. Paul tells us the Church was founded on the Apostles and prophets not that they were cofounders. Eph 2:20

Thanks so much. Charism in consecrated life is a hard term to pin down in an univocal manner in any religious order, it takes on a unique shape given their respective histories of foundation. The LCs have and will continue to exploit its nuanced meaning, in a camelion-like manner, to escape the true remedies they need to apply, i.e. dissolution.

Hold on to this Giselle, and paste it every time some high ranking LC tries to define the LC charism in slippery manner. This is what the founder formally transmitted; this was the constituent nature of the charism as he set it forth...'living what was in his soul', narcissist that he was. It was not the authentic self-effacing witness of that sequela Christi that holy founders humbly radiated to their cofounders. It was not a particular and unique service to the Church, other than the naricissism of saving all humanity- which is what MM has the LC do.
Yes, let's remember this is the objective and factual reference from the founder as to where is the charism of the LC. If you want to keep LC in name, then this is the chalice you must drink from, and I do not think it belongs to Christ.

Well put, Anonymous @ 1:03pm.

gregorbo, that is exactly what LC/RC members have done. There is also an uber-famous quote that Maciel attributed to JPII. I am not sure which letter of Maciel it can be found in, maybe it's the Chicago letter, or Time and Eternity. I can't remember. Any LC who was in the Legion in the '90's heard this quote a gazillion times. Here's the quote: JPII, in a private conversation with another Cardinal, says, "Hard times are coming for the Legionaries and Regnum Christi members if they want to be faithful to their charism." This quote was literally drilled into our heads. It was read outloud on retreats, spiritual exercises, and during meals. It was one of the top 10 LC quotes during the '90s.

So what happens in the Kool-aid saturated minds circa Feb 2009? Their brains frantically race to retrieve that quote and they cling to it as a papal prophecy. As long as they cling to it as prophetic, the more the walls tumble upon them, the harder they cling to the prophecy and their Regnum. Like a pitt bull or a leech.

I sent some docs to the Archbishop, but I don't think that was included. Are you sure you are not going to get arrested for posting it????:) Those are really bad. Any good order reflects the charism OF THE HOLY SPIRIT that the founder was inspired to make concrete in the world. An order does not exist to reflect the soul of the founder.


"454. In conclusion, it would be opportune to remember here the words of Paul VI: Religious institutions are vigorous and flourish when, in their discipline, in their works and the customs of life of their members, they integrally reflect the soul of their Founders."

The actual quote is:

"For Religious Institutes will flourish and prosper so long as the integral spirit of their Founder continues to inspire their rule of life and apostolic works, as well as the actions and lives of their members."

The spirit of the founder, not his soul.

I'm going to be nitpicky here but the former is an established term in the Church, the latter suggests a haunting of some kind. The former suggests a genuine charism inspired by the Holy Spirit, the latter suggests a circling of the wagons around MM.

I'm sure it's just a poor translation from the Spanish, but to me it appears as more evidence that the legion has twisted Christianity into Macielism. Subtly changing a word here and there may not seem like a big detail but actually we now see how the devil is in those little details.

(I'm sure the brothers during their formation are encouraged to read and meditate upon these norms. No wonder everyone has been so "serene" this past year as the enemies of the Church - oops, make that enemies of Maciel's church - heap "persecution" upon them).

There is NO religious commu nity approved by the church with documents like these. The legion of maciel and their founder are a complete fraud.

The pathologies of the legion leaders are further revealed in their constant re-editing of the legion party line. It seems that there are those in the inner circle whose task it is to tinker continuously with the charism.

There is a Soviet photograph of the leaders of the October revolution, but when Trotsky fell into bad odor with Stalin,Trotsky was edited out. Because of careless Soviet editing, Trotsky's elbow survives unexplained in the photo. The legion inner circle attempts to reshape and reinvent the legion story, but the shadow of mm - unnamed, unidentified - falls over their work, like Trotsky's elbow.

I love that story, reid-"Trotsky's elbow", eh?

Jeannette: to be clear, I don't lay claim to creating “Trotsky's elbow.” I ran across mention of Trotsky's elbow while reading a review of a book about the Soviet Union. I do, however, see a parallel between the Soviets' doctoring of photos in an attempt to rewrite history and the legion's tinkering with its writings.

To reid, 10:02 AM
To be accurate, the person edited out of Stalin's photo was Nikolai Yezhov not Trotsky. See
Nevertheless the idea expressed is still accurate.

Sam, I googled "Trotsky's elbow" and found some responses; I don't know if the sites are more reputable than Wikipedia, though.

Great parallel either way-thanks for the heads-up reid!

Sam,thanks for insisting on accuracy. Jeannette, thanks for pursuing "Trotsky's elbow." I plan to dig a little deeper into this matter of Trotsky's elbow and should have something in a few days. I will post what I find on this thread, "Deciphering the obvious." Maybe I will also post my findings on whatever thread is current later in the week so that at least the three of us will have a bit more certainty about Trotsky's elbow.

You People have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. It amazes what an easy victory you give to the father of lies (and for those who are uneducated as most of you seem to be) this means the DEVIL. I am not RC but without the fruits from this movement (aka: individuals who have been a martyr unto themselves and who have lived fully and truly) I would NOT KNOW GOD AND THE ROMAN CATHOLIC FAITH. You fail to remember that GOD BRINGS GOOD OUT OF ALL THINGS even the MOST horrid sins! There ARE individuals who have participated in the movement and still do including some Legionaries and Regnum Christi Women who are TRULY SAINTS and what is SO remarkable is that they are not "BRAINWASHED” and live authentically as human beings who are filled with the sweet love of Jesus Christ. If any of you truly proclaim yourselves Catholic I would consider taking in all realms, every aspect including the fact that it has brought people to Jesus Christ and this should be your ultimate goal: to preach the GOOD NEWS and not commit slander and calumny as the blog is perpetuating. I will continue to pray for all those who are apart of such treachery and hope that you can come to see the truth of good, evil, and above ALL God's desire to bring good and truth upon this earth so that the human race, all the souls that he loves so dearly, can come closer to him and experience HIS LOVE IN FULLNESS.

Rest assured everyone here is praying for you.

Follow-up to “Trotsky's elbow” of March 13, 10:02 a.m., and subsequent comments from Jeannette and Sam: When I am hunting for information, Wikipedia and other on-line sources are a start, but just a start. For my money, I prefer to go by the book.

Thanks to one of the great boons of our time – interlibrary loan – I now have in my hands a copy of The Commissar Vanishes: The Falsification of Photographs and Art in Stalin's Russia by David King. Based upon King's private 250,000-piece collection of photographs, posters, and illustrations relating to Russia and the former Soviet Union,the book shows how images were manipulated by the Soviet regime.

Included in the book are the photographs of the disappearing Yezhov that Wikipedia posts on its site. Also in King's book is the original untouched photograph of Lenin and Trotsky in Red Square celebrating the second anniversary of the revolution. King presents the heavily retouched Soviet versions of this photograph in which the commissar Trotsky has vanished. In some of these heavily cropped photos, most of Trotsky has been edited out except for a mysterious elbow – Trotsky's elbow.

All hail, jolly good show! I'm thoroughly impressed with your research (though, as ever, appalled at the horror of it all).

I'm a former RC member who balked whenever MM was mentioned and referred to as "Nuestro Padre," or "Our Father." I could never bring myself to say "Nuestro Padre." Ultimately, that was the first bad taste I had in my mouth. I realized it was time for me to leave when I found great amounts of my "time, talent and treasure" being used for the purposes of encouraging parish priests to deliver pre-packaged homilies, written by LC priests, at their parish masses through ePriest. I was working closely with 2nd and 3rd level RC members at this point. Obviously, I wasn't 'formed' enough to be where I was, because I saw through it all.

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